In mini episode 42.1 of Rabbit Hole of Research, the team is hanging out in the Basement Studio to unpack the themes and questions raised in Episode 42: Broken Futures with author Ben Tanzer. They revisit Ben’s novel Orphans, reflecting on dystopian visions, the psychological toll of modern life, and the blurred line between human and machine. Inspired by listener Alex’s comments, they explore cloning, forced leisure, and shifting generational perspectives on labor and identity.
The conversation expands into science fiction and cultural critiques—from AI replacing six-figure jobs to televised classrooms in Gary, Indiana. Pop culture cameos include Twilight Zone, The Stand, and Ed Emberley’s latest. Book recs and movie picks round out the episode, along with teasers for upcoming shows, events, and Joe’s Dragon Con schedule.
Also Check out: “Specific Knowledge: Transformation” at From Beyond Press
Joe explores how many calories it would take to transform into monsters across sci-fi and horror—think 222 Big Macs and tubs of Cherry Garcia.
It’s science for Weirdos
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Stay curious, stay speculative, stay safe, and we’ll catch you in the next rabbit hole. Love Y'all!
Future Events:
Red Line: Chicago Horror Stories – Book Release Party
August 27, 6:00 PM – Comfort Station Logan Square, 2579 N. Milwaukee Ave., Chicago
A celebration of the new anthology Red Line: Chicago Horror Stories, featuring live readings by over 10 authors, including Joe. The evening includes an all-Chicago DJ set by Plastic Crimewave, followed by an 8:00 PM screening of the German silent film Journey into the Night with a live score by Ira Glass (band).
Event link: https://www.facebook.com/events/761531809703016/
Order: Red Line: Chicago Horror Stories Anthology
Dragon Con 2025 – August 28–September 1, Atlanta, GA
Joe appears as an Attending Professional with five events:
Aug 29, 10:00 AM – Did a Wizard Do It? The Physics of High Fantasy (L401-L403, Marriott)
Aug 29, 1:00 PM – Sinners: The Devil at the Door (Centennial I, Hyatt)
Aug 30, 11:30 AM - Fandom Fusion: Where Classroom Meets Imagination! (Hanover AB, Hyatt)
Aug 30, 1:00 PM – Reading Session: Jotham R. Austin, II (Marietta, Hyatt)
Aug 31, 7:00 PM – Pantsing or Plotting? (Embassy AB, Hyatt)
Sept 1, 10:00 AM – Enchanting Realms: Black Voices in Fantasy! (Hanover AB, Hyatt)
Upcoming Episodes
EP43: Animal Swarms (Sep 3) with science communicator Josh Fisher
EP44: H20MG – Lake Michigan, Life, and Everything in Between (Sep 17) with author and activist Maud Lavin
EP45–47: October Month of Horror
A trilogy of chilling episodes celebrating horror in literature, film, and culture. Expect field trips, spooky themes, and special guests.
Links, Resources, and Topics Mentioned in mini and/or full episode:
Books & Media Discussed
Ben Tanzer – Orphans: The novel at the heart of Episode 42’s discussion on trauma, cloning, and societal collapse.
Ben Tanzer – After Hours: Memoir reflecting on parenting, mental health, and masculinity.
Mark Russell – Traveling to Mars: A graphic novel recommended by listener Alex, echoing Orphans in its themes of isolation, capitalism, and existential drift.
Holly Jackson – The Reappearance of Rachel Price: A mystery novel mentioned during the mini episode wrap-up.
Jason Pargin – What the Hell Did I Just Read: Third book in the John Dies at the End series; discussed as part of recent media consumption.
Jason Pargin – If This Book Exists, You’re in the Wrong Universe: Follow-up mentioned as next on the reading list.
Stephen King Universe – The End of the World As We Know It (edited by Christopher Golden & Brian Keene): A collection of short stories set in the world of The Stand.
Amran’s Leverage: New novel release highlighted by Joe, tied to the speculative and horror themes of the podcast.
Ed Emberley – Take A Breath, Big Red Monster: Children’s book praised for creativity and visual design.
Topics Explored
Forced Leisure: A recurring theme involving the societal consequences of automation and job displacement.
AI and Robot Labor: Discussion about the economic and psychological implications of AI replacing high- and low-skill labor.
Work Culture & Capitalism: How labor is tied to self-worth in U.S. culture, contrasted with European models.
Cloning and Identity: A through-line topic from Orphans to podcast banter (e.g., AI-generated versions of the hosts).
Education & Automation: Case mentioned of Indiana schools replacing teachers with AI-delivered content.
COVID-era Work Shifts: Listener commentary on how the pandemic accelerated re-evaluation of labor norms.
Generational Perspectives on Work: Observations about shifting attitudes toward work-life balance and retirement.
Science & Fiction Connections in Episodes
Cloning & AI Replacement
Ben Tanzer’s Orphans imagines humans replaced by AI clones.
Ties to current tech in synthetic media and voice cloning.
The hosts joke about AI replacing themselves—an increasingly plausible idea.
Forced Leisure & Automation
“Forced leisure” reflects automation displacing human labor.
Echoes themes from Wall-E and Player Piano.
Listener comments link it to capitalist notions of worth and European work culture contrasts.
AI in Education
Discussion of Indiana schools using AI instead of teachers.
Evokes dystopian fiction (Fahrenheit 451, The Machine Stops).
Raises real concerns about depersonalized learning.
Swarm Intelligence (EP43 Tease)
Upcoming episode explores emergent behavior in animals.
Connects to sci-fi “hive mind” tropes (Starship Troopers, Annihilation).
Post-COVID Cultural Shifts
Pandemic reframed ideas of labor, purpose, and risk.
Parallels speculative works like Severance and Station Eleven.
If we missed anything, comment or email us and we’ll get the info to you!
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